Urban Review STL

I have been hearing rumors of development plans on Lansdowne Ave near the new Shrewsbuury Metro stop that would buy out the surrounding houses for development. Anyone have any insite on this or a usefull link?

I live on the other side of Hampton (technically part of Southwest Garden) and frequently go to the 7-11 at 2807 Sulphur Ave (and Watson). They've had a petition against the QT on their counter for a few weeks. A QT would obviously hurt this place as well.

Jim and Brian:

Thanks for filling-in what I couldn't recall.

mmmmmmm, Lion's Choice.... I want one near me!

Maybe I should post this anonymously. I'm sure there will be fall-out from my statement in favor of Lion's Choice.

[REPLY Fallout? From me? I am a vegetarian and hate drive-thru restaurants in the city. Having said that, Lion's Choice might make a good fit for one of the now vacant Burger King locations we have. - SLP]

Someone early in this discussion was asking for my opinion on the QT based on the one that was relocated along Gravois here in the great community of Affton.

I have obtained the (Florida) phone number of the property manager of our QT. If Josh or anyone else wants it, contact me. As for the Affton site and potential deed restrictions, I have an email out to my peeps at St. Louis County Planning and Econ. Development to see if I can get you an answer.

The property they vacated at Gravois & Siebert is still for sale...no car lot yet, but they did dig up their tanks.

Chippewa & Landsdowne = Starbucks & Lion's Choice, with LC going into the old Taco Bell and Starbucks getting the new building, both with druive-thru's . . .

While I don't live in Clifton Heights, I do live fairly closeby - a QT at Hampton and Columbia would be a huge mistake.

Sinclair is not a locally-owned company, but the franchisee does a great job with that station - it's clean, the employees are friendly, and they're a great neighbor.

BTW, the Chippewa/Lansdowne development will be a Starbuck's and a Lion's Choice.

The QT has/had the Zito's/Wash U Laundry and two houses under contract. I had heard the rumor that they were looking at this location so I called an arranged to have them come and speak at our neighborhood association mtg.

The meeting itself was an informational meeting that at points turned a bit more emotional but thats to be expected with something as big as a QT. We did have alot of our questions answered by the rep from QT and he did take a lions share of venting about it as well.

In order for them to move in and build a 12 pump (6 side by side pumps) they needed both buildings as well as one more house. The house at the corner of columbia and hampton actually comes with the property.

Ald Waterhouse was in attendance as was former Ald Bauer- which was quite a shock to say the least.

At this point we will be taking a vote on monday the 26th at 7pm at Mason School to declare our official position. I have only seen and heard overwhelming opposition to it.

So my hope is that we can work with the city and our alderman to find something to go into that old Zito's spot as oppossed to leaving it vacant for two more years. I do believe that there is a nice middle ground that we can acheive wherein we have some development in our area that benefits both the residents and the city.

Thats all for now kids- your all welcome to our next meeting which is Monday June 26th at Mason School 7-9 We'll also have four of the candidates for state senate race that night as well. Contact me offlist if you have any questions-thanks

Josh Wiese
President Clifton Heights Neighborhood Association

"As for Clifton Heights, I'm pretty sure that the demolition on the SW corner of 44 and Hampton is for a new Drury Inn, not a QT"

A QT is going to be placed where the Wash U Coin Laundry currently is, and where Vito's used to be. Furthermore, 2 homes behind the buildings are to be destroyed as well.

QT disclosed all of this information at the Clifton Heights meeting. My uncle and several of my friends testified against this development. QT sent a representative to the meeting. Waterhouse, I believe, was also at the meeting.

Furthermore, the market is saturated with gas stations on this street, and either the locally owned Sinclair, or the corporate chain Shell will be closing. I would rather see the Sinclair open, because they close at 9 for the purpose of controlling late night liquor sales.

From what I was told, everyone is against this area of Hampton turning into fast food and gas stations. Interesting!!!

My prediction is that the old location will sit vacant for at least 3 years, become un-stable from lack of maintenace and turn into an even worse blight on the neighborhood. It will then be torn down by the city, and the abandoned and un-maintained lot will sit for another 2-3 years with no development.

After this period, it might possibly get some treatment. While street-side retail with residential above would be great, I consider it a pipe dream. It will not be brick, it will not be up to the sidewalk, there will be no residential.

Retail will probably fail, as the deed restrictions prohibit any type of neighborhood pub, convienence store, drug store, magazine/book store, etc. Basically any type of retail that would fit in nicely on a neighborhood scale, and be affordable/startable by the typical entreprenuer of the area.

No, what will go in is probably some crap fly-by-night "buy here pay here" auto lot, check cashing store, etc.

The new location will draw complaints from residents arising from the new 24/7 activity, flood lights, noise, odors, and trash that will replace a - while ugly, but - quiet, 5-day/wk, 9-5 type business. One only need to look up the street at Gravois and Hydraulic to see the residental housing blasted by the 10,000-watt, tractor-beam, landing strip flodlights illuminating the fronts of their homes and the lovely view of the new Slop-'n-Slave. Or the sanitary conditions of the 7-11/Citgo on the corner...

This new QT is in Dutchtown, not Bevo. In fact, the 25th Ward doesn't have any part of Bevo, but ends at the railroad tracks, which is also where Dutchtown ends.

[REPLY Yes, as I indicated above the rumor is they would close the Bevo location at Gravois near Delor once the new location in the 25th Ward opened. - SLP]

Dave:

Starbucks and....dang, I forget the other restaraunt going in there (some casual dining place like an Applebee's-type). But, St. Louis Hills gave it's approval, so you could get the info from them, I'm sure. Here is their website with contact info: http://stlouis.missouri.org/stlouishills/.

totally unrelated... but can anyone tell me what's going in on Chippewa/Landsdowne (I think... it's where Steak n Shake and Taco Bell once stood)?

Seems like a decent enough idea to me! Gravois and Chippewa is a car-focused intersection anyway, with car dealers on all four corners.

This would be a great location for a high visibility filling station.

The deed restrictions indicated on the QT web site for "surplus property" regarding the former Gravois and Seibert store don't seem that unusual in such situations:

"Deed Restrictions: Buyer acknowledges and agrees that the Special Warranty Deed conveying the Property to the Buyer shall contain a restriction which shall run with the land prohibiting the use of the Property as a place of adult entertainment, retail grocery store, retail convenience grocery store or for the sale of tobacco products, adult materials, drug paraphernalia, package or carry-out beer, wine, liquor, or spirits (such restriction will not prohibit a restaurant, sports bar, or cocktail lounge selling such items for on premise consumption), or for the retail sale of motor fuels for a period of twenty (20) years from the date of recording of the deed, or until there is not a QuikTrip convenience store within a one (1) mile radius of the Property, whichever is longer."

While there are an awful lot of QTs on Gravois, a Gravois and Chippewa location would be MUCH safer and more convenient than the current 15-year-old store at Gravois and Wilcox, which breaks up a potential pedestrian-oriented shopping district.

If the Bevo location could be redeveloped with sidewalk-fronting retail with residential above, then I wouldn't see any loss in QT relocating to a used car lot on the corner of an already very auto-oriented intersection.

But knowing St. Louis, the existing QT itself would more likely become some indy used car place, retaining the canopy and c-store for sheltering vehicles and a sales office. Such cheap conversion would just plaster some cheap new signage over existing and remove the pumps, but not the islands or tanks. As cheaply built as fast food drive-thrus and gas stations are, they never seem to go away that easily, many converting to funky businesses, but retaining their eerily recognizable form.

As for Clifton Heights, I'm pretty sure that the demolition on the SW corner of 44 and Hampton is for a new Drury Inn, not a QT . . .

As for the station at Gravois and Chippewa, I heard the same information last night at a neighborhood meeting, although there was no mention of the other location closing. I don't think the new station is a rumor, as someone for QT has approached neighborhoods about the new station.

[REPLY - I posted it as a rumor as I had not personally substantiated any of the information but was relying on a reliable source. - SLP]

QT wants to demolish Vitos and Wash U coin laundry for a station. The residents are strongly against the idea for many reasons, as well as the owner of Sinclar up the street.

Hampton has plenty of gas stations, and there is no reason to add another one.

Residents do not want the southern edge of Hampton to turn out like the section north of 44: all fast food and gas stations.

Many of my personal friends testified against the Hampton QT proposal.

We will see if it is blocked.

First, let me say that your website is the best source for St. Louis news. I get more from logging in here and reading about STL issues, than watching local 10pm news, reading STLtoday, or the Journal. Good work.

On QT: why are people opposed to QT's? Gas stations are a necessary convenience/evil. Get in and get out. Yeah, they look like crap, but we need them, right? QT at least has decent and well manicured landscaping. The 7-11 Citgo's look really bad, the Phillips 66's look even worse. In fact, the only cool looking filling station that comes to mind is the BP (Amoco) on South Grand.

I tend to go out of my way to fill up at the STL stations because at least the taxes go to my city and not the suburbs. Maybe I should rethink this and fill up in the burbs, so they get all the eyesore gas stations and they shutter the city ones.

What does QT have going on in Clifton Heights? Are they working on their first Hampton Avenue location?

And Steve, kudos. You're among the first in STL media to get the no "c" in QuikTrip spelling of the company name right.

Relocating a QT store for better visibility, better access, more parking, and a more competitive location? Sounds like they're following a strategic business model.

What will happen with the Bevo Mill location? What not ask the Mayor of Affton? He's got a closed QT in his backyard along Gravois.

What will they do with the closed stores? Remove the tanks, and sell to the highest bidder.

Here's a neat game...try to predict the next QT store to be relocated.

Watch out Maplewood...your Big Bend and Flora location might be the next one to close.

[REPLY - I'm not sure what QT was doing at Clifton Heights but I know there was talk of a location there sometime back --- that was part of what got Bauer recalled.

I'm not so convinced QT moving for better access and such. So many national chains now simply must keep getting bigger and bigger to grow sales. Ultimately they want more pumps and five years from now they'll want even more so they'll move to another spot. At some point we must say no to these massive gas stations.

And why is this a problem? Well, they impose deed restrictions on closed stations to prevent competition. So what was built as a gas station can only get used as something else. That is why many sit vacant for so long. I don't think Bevo would be interested in another used car lot along Gravois...

And yes, I am not known for my spelling but QuikTrip is one that I do know where spell check can't help! - SLP]